1 00:00:04,280 --> 00:00:02,600 hello dr. Cal just racing to get a 2 00:00:06,590 --> 00:00:04,290 triangle just wish all these skeptic 3 00:00:08,690 --> 00:00:06,600 zone listings are happy Christmas to all 4 00:00:11,299 --> 00:00:08,700 a skipped annoyed list I wish you a 5 00:00:13,430 --> 00:00:11,309 happy Christmas even though I always 6 00:00:16,340 --> 00:00:13,440 like an excuse for a party okay thanks 7 00:00:18,170 --> 00:00:16,350 dr. cult thank you he's running for 8 00:00:20,480 --> 00:00:18,180 train I know it's very 20th century of 9 00:00:21,890 --> 00:00:20,490 in but that's what you're doing yeah you 10 00:00:24,019 --> 00:00:21,900 should be running for hovercraft or 11 00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:24,029 something with a hoverboard that's what 12 00:00:35,750 --> 00:00:33,090 I want to know welcome to the skeptic 13 00:00:47,850 --> 00:00:35,760 zone the podcast from Australia for 14 00:00:54,190 --> 00:00:50,380 hello and welcome to the skeptic zone 15 00:00:57,490 --> 00:00:54,200 episode number 218 for the twenty-second 16 00:01:00,760 --> 00:00:57,500 of December 2012 Richard Saunders here 17 00:01:03,070 --> 00:01:00,770 with you from an echo chamber well now 18 00:01:06,460 --> 00:01:03,080 not it not exactly it's just a spare 19 00:01:08,859 --> 00:01:06,470 room here in Auckland New Zealand i'm 20 00:01:11,740 --> 00:01:08,869 making a flying visit here to auckland 21 00:01:14,230 --> 00:01:11,750 and beautiful new zealand on my way to 22 00:01:17,530 --> 00:01:14,240 the Bay Area San Francisco for Christmas 23 00:01:20,170 --> 00:01:17,540 and what's so special about the 22nd of 24 00:01:22,930 --> 00:01:20,180 december 2012 well it's the date that 25 00:01:25,330 --> 00:01:22,940 wasn't supposed to happen thank you to 26 00:01:26,650 --> 00:01:25,340 all those new-age twits who scared 27 00:01:29,230 --> 00:01:26,660 little children and talking about 28 00:01:31,330 --> 00:01:29,240 scaring little children here's a piece 29 00:01:33,609 --> 00:01:31,340 about the the end of the world 30 00:01:35,499 --> 00:01:33,619 apocalypse or that shift in cosmic 31 00:01:40,719 --> 00:01:35,509 thinking or whatever the hell was going 32 00:01:55,590 --> 00:01:40,729 on for the 21st of December I recorded a 33 00:02:04,270 --> 00:02:00,060 published online on the 19th of december 34 00:02:08,410 --> 00:02:04,280 2012 thoughts on the 21st of december 35 00:02:11,080 --> 00:02:08,420 2012 by Richard Saunders so it's almost 36 00:02:13,780 --> 00:02:11,090 here the so-called end of the world or 37 00:02:18,670 --> 00:02:13,790 the beginning of the great change or 38 00:02:22,030 --> 00:02:18,680 shift in spiritual energies or fill in 39 00:02:24,490 --> 00:02:22,040 the blanks the 21st of december will 40 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:24,500 come and go like any other day maybe 41 00:02:29,920 --> 00:02:27,410 some newsworthy event will happen but 42 00:02:32,890 --> 00:02:29,930 somewhere around the world every week of 43 00:02:36,070 --> 00:02:32,900 the year and newsworthy event catches 44 00:02:39,250 --> 00:02:36,080 our attention the 21st of december 2012 45 00:02:43,420 --> 00:02:39,260 is destined to be the answer to a pub 46 00:02:45,430 --> 00:02:43,430 trivia night question in 2020 it will be 47 00:02:48,729 --> 00:02:45,440 largely forgotten just like all the 48 00:02:51,970 --> 00:02:48,739 other the planets will align or my 49 00:02:54,310 --> 00:02:51,980 dreams told me that on this day or our 50 00:02:57,940 --> 00:02:54,320 great spiritual leader has promised that 51 00:03:01,390 --> 00:02:57,950 on this date or the ancients knew that 52 00:03:03,819 --> 00:03:01,400 on this date or this time the world is 53 00:03:07,180 --> 00:03:03,829 really coming to an end and we have the 54 00:03:09,479 --> 00:03:07,190 proof or well one of the hundreds of 55 00:03:12,539 --> 00:03:09,489 other failed prophecies and predictions 56 00:03:16,270 --> 00:03:12,549 that frighten little children and sadly 57 00:03:19,210 --> 00:03:16,280 some adults what you will hear on the 58 00:03:21,699 --> 00:03:19,220 twenty-second of december from those who 59 00:03:23,770 --> 00:03:21,709 need this state to mean something will 60 00:03:26,289 --> 00:03:23,780 be along the lines of there was a great 61 00:03:29,199 --> 00:03:26,299 change but you are a closed minded 62 00:03:31,509 --> 00:03:29,209 skeptic and cannot feel it or it has 63 00:03:34,470 --> 00:03:31,519 started just as we predicted and over 64 00:03:37,420 --> 00:03:34,480 the next so-and-so years the earth will 65 00:03:40,900 --> 00:03:37,430 we have all seen and heard this many 66 00:03:43,690 --> 00:03:40,910 times before the only sure thing is that 67 00:03:46,330 --> 00:03:43,700 before long another mystical date based 68 00:03:48,550 --> 00:03:46,340 on special insights from those who are 69 00:04:01,250 --> 00:03:48,560 enlightened will be doing the rounds and 70 00:04:05,460 --> 00:04:03,660 so there you go the next time somebody 71 00:04:09,110 --> 00:04:05,470 tells you the world's coming to an end 72 00:04:12,479 --> 00:04:09,120 based on ancient predictions and ancient 73 00:04:16,020 --> 00:04:12,489 prophecies I want you to think very 74 00:04:18,539 --> 00:04:16,030 carefully and tell them this yeah on 75 00:04:21,360 --> 00:04:18,549 this week's show more on our story 76 00:04:23,159 --> 00:04:21,370 covered in last week by dr. HC about the 77 00:04:26,250 --> 00:04:23,169 Minister for fair trading in New South 78 00:04:28,320 --> 00:04:26,260 Wales Australia Anthony Roberts clamping 79 00:04:30,810 --> 00:04:28,330 down on the Australian vaccination 80 00:04:33,060 --> 00:04:30,820 network and telling them not asking not 81 00:04:35,040 --> 00:04:33,070 requesting telling them they have to 82 00:04:37,980 --> 00:04:35,050 change their name because their name is 83 00:04:39,870 --> 00:04:37,990 misleading I'm going to read the press 84 00:04:43,020 --> 00:04:39,880 statement from the minister and that's 85 00:04:45,870 --> 00:04:43,030 followed by a couple of media reports we 86 00:04:49,500 --> 00:04:45,880 have Tracy Spicer and Tim Webster on 87 00:04:52,189 --> 00:04:49,510 radio 2ue and they actually get a phone 88 00:04:54,750 --> 00:04:52,199 call from the Minister for Fair Trading 89 00:04:58,500 --> 00:04:54,760 following that a clip from the ABC 90 00:05:01,620 --> 00:04:58,510 program the drum all covering this issue 91 00:05:04,200 --> 00:05:01,630 I think you will really enjoy those 92 00:05:07,200 --> 00:05:04,210 clips coming up and after that it's 93 00:05:09,390 --> 00:05:07,210 Maynard spooky action at a distance not 94 00:05:12,120 --> 00:05:09,400 not a very far distance it's back to 95 00:05:14,159 --> 00:05:12,130 Melbourne where Maynard will chat to DJ 96 00:05:16,620 --> 00:05:14,169 Grothe president of the James Randi 97 00:05:18,750 --> 00:05:16,630 Educational Foundation Iran sir give 98 00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:18,760 former president of the Australian 99 00:05:24,029 --> 00:05:22,330 skeptics dr. rachel herself myself 100 00:05:25,860 --> 00:05:24,039 Richard Saunders current president of 101 00:05:28,050 --> 00:05:25,870 outlets lots of presence everywhere and 102 00:05:31,620 --> 00:05:28,060 a very strange woman who was there 103 00:05:34,560 --> 00:05:31,630 wearing Devil's horns coming up later in 104 00:05:37,589 --> 00:05:34,570 the show but for now I'm going to run to 105 00:05:39,149 --> 00:05:37,599 the other room where the fridge is not 106 00:05:41,550 --> 00:05:39,159 the same fringe I normally run to this 107 00:05:42,870 --> 00:05:41,560 is a new zealand fridge what do I find 108 00:05:45,750 --> 00:05:42,880 in that fridge i bet i find some 109 00:05:48,330 --> 00:05:45,760 Steinlager or some beautiful new zealand 110 00:06:11,950 --> 00:05:48,340 white wine I'm going to enjoy that while 111 00:06:17,740 --> 00:06:14,930 media release from the Honorable Anthony 112 00:06:22,570 --> 00:06:17,750 Roberts MP Minister for Fair Trading 113 00:06:25,760 --> 00:06:22,580 dated Saturday 15th of december 2012 114 00:06:28,910 --> 00:06:25,770 australian vaccination network ordered 115 00:06:31,010 --> 00:06:28,920 to change its name minister for Fair 116 00:06:34,070 --> 00:06:31,020 Trading Anthony Roberts today confirmed 117 00:06:36,920 --> 00:06:34,080 a formal order has been issued to the 118 00:06:38,990 --> 00:06:36,930 Australian vaccination network to change 119 00:06:41,840 --> 00:06:39,000 its names on the grounds it is 120 00:06:44,210 --> 00:06:41,850 misleading the public mr. Roberts said 121 00:06:47,720 --> 00:06:44,220 section 11 of the association's in 122 00:06:50,210 --> 00:06:47,730 corporations act 2009 provides the 123 00:06:53,210 --> 00:06:50,220 Commissioner for Fair Trading may direct 124 00:06:55,300 --> 00:06:53,220 an association to adopt a new name where 125 00:06:58,790 --> 00:06:55,310 the name of the Association is 126 00:07:00,950 --> 00:06:58,800 unacceptable quote New South Wales Fair 127 00:07:03,530 --> 00:07:00,960 Trading has received complaints that the 128 00:07:06,350 --> 00:07:03,540 Australian vaccination networks name is 129 00:07:08,750 --> 00:07:06,360 confusing and has misled the public as 130 00:07:12,050 --> 00:07:08,760 to its operational intention end quote 131 00:07:14,810 --> 00:07:12,060 mr. Roberts said quote the Commissioner 132 00:07:16,670 --> 00:07:14,820 for Fair Trading rod Stowe as therefore 133 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:16,680 written to the Australian vaccination 134 00:07:22,340 --> 00:07:19,410 network directing the Association to 135 00:07:24,500 --> 00:07:22,350 change its name end quote the Australian 136 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:24,510 vaccination network is required to lodge 137 00:07:31,190 --> 00:07:26,970 an application for registration of a new 138 00:07:33,800 --> 00:07:31,200 name by the 21st of februari 2013 if an 139 00:07:36,050 --> 00:07:33,810 application for registration of a change 140 00:07:38,750 --> 00:07:36,060 of name is not made on or before that 141 00:07:41,120 --> 00:07:38,760 date Australian vaccination Network 142 00:07:43,430 --> 00:07:41,130 incorporated's registration may be 143 00:07:45,200 --> 00:07:43,440 cancelled mr. Roberts said the 144 00:07:48,260 --> 00:07:45,210 Australian vaccination networks name 145 00:07:50,330 --> 00:07:48,270 cannot be tolerated given its stance on 146 00:07:53,660 --> 00:07:50,340 vaccination and the potential for 147 00:07:56,090 --> 00:07:53,670 parents to be confused or misled quote 148 00:07:58,130 --> 00:07:56,100 the Australian vaccination network does 149 00:08:00,650 --> 00:07:58,140 not present a balanced case for 150 00:08:02,360 --> 00:08:00,660 vaccination does not present medical 151 00:08:05,060 --> 00:08:02,370 evidence to back up its claims and 152 00:08:07,550 --> 00:08:05,070 therefore poses a serious risk of 153 00:08:10,460 --> 00:08:07,560 misleading the community end quote mr. 154 00:08:11,750 --> 00:08:10,470 Roberts said quote the Australian 155 00:08:14,180 --> 00:08:11,760 vaccination network 156 00:08:16,270 --> 00:08:14,190 can therefore find a new name that is 157 00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:16,280 more appropriate given its 158 00:08:22,310 --> 00:08:20,010 anti-vaccination stance end quote mr. 159 00:08:24,650 --> 00:08:22,320 Roberts said the decision to order the 160 00:08:27,290 --> 00:08:24,660 change of name was based on concerns 161 00:08:30,260 --> 00:08:27,300 raised by parents medical professionals 162 00:08:32,840 --> 00:08:30,270 and the wider community across New South 163 00:08:34,820 --> 00:08:32,850 Wales quote it is clear this 164 00:08:37,400 --> 00:08:34,830 associations name is not appropriate 165 00:08:39,290 --> 00:08:37,410 given what it stands for and the 166 00:08:42,020 --> 00:08:39,300 O'Farrell stoner government is committed 167 00:08:44,240 --> 00:08:42,030 to ensuring the community is not misled 168 00:08:47,420 --> 00:08:44,250 on a critically important public health 169 00:08:50,120 --> 00:08:47,430 issue such as vaccinations and quote mr. 170 00:08:52,340 --> 00:08:50,130 Roberts said quote we are asking the 171 00:08:54,890 --> 00:08:52,350 Australian a vaccination network to be 172 00:08:58,460 --> 00:08:54,900 honest and upfront about what they stand 173 00:09:05,150 --> 00:08:58,470 for and to choose a new name reflecting 174 00:09:06,500 --> 00:09:05,160 their beliefs end quote now I'd like to 175 00:09:09,230 --> 00:09:06,510 give a big cheerio to the New South 176 00:09:11,210 --> 00:09:09,240 Wales Government tin but ordering the 177 00:09:14,300 --> 00:09:11,220 Australian vaccination Network I don't 178 00:09:15,920 --> 00:09:14,310 often do this to change its name now if 179 00:09:17,540 --> 00:09:15,930 you followed any of my opinion pieces 180 00:09:19,460 --> 00:09:17,550 over the last couple of years I cannot 181 00:09:21,350 --> 00:09:19,470 stand this mob they call themselves the 182 00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:21,360 Australian vaccination network they're 183 00:09:25,190 --> 00:09:23,250 clearly anti-vaccination based on no 184 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:25,200 facts whatsoever just based on some 185 00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:27,450 cockamamie theories and of course it's 186 00:09:31,790 --> 00:09:28,890 led to an increase in whooping cough and 187 00:09:33,500 --> 00:09:31,800 various other things for tiny vulnerable 188 00:09:35,450 --> 00:09:33,510 children well good on the Minister for 189 00:09:37,100 --> 00:09:35,460 Fair Trading Anthony Roberts for issuing 190 00:09:39,170 --> 00:09:37,110 a formal order for them to change their 191 00:09:41,180 --> 00:09:39,180 name saying calling themselves the 192 00:09:43,340 --> 00:09:41,190 Australian vaccination network does not 193 00:09:44,780 --> 00:09:43,350 present a balanced case for vaccination 194 00:09:46,700 --> 00:09:44,790 does not present medical evidence to 195 00:09:49,310 --> 00:09:46,710 back up its claims and therefore poses a 196 00:09:52,700 --> 00:09:49,320 serious risk of misleading the community 197 00:09:54,260 --> 00:09:52,710 yeah so their response yes do you want 198 00:09:55,820 --> 00:09:54,270 to hear they're responsible wasn't yes 199 00:09:58,220 --> 00:09:55,830 this is Meryl Dory who of course lives 200 00:10:00,290 --> 00:09:58,230 in the bar in bay region how about the 201 00:10:02,690 --> 00:10:00,300 cancer council couldn't someone be 202 00:10:05,930 --> 00:10:02,700 misled into thinking there for cancer 203 00:10:07,730 --> 00:10:05,940 what and then she has a go saying it's a 204 00:10:09,620 --> 00:10:07,740 conflict of interest because the 205 00:10:11,450 --> 00:10:09,630 original complaint about the name the 206 00:10:13,430 --> 00:10:11,460 Australian vaccination network is from 207 00:10:15,110 --> 00:10:13,440 the Australian Medical Association and 208 00:10:17,390 --> 00:10:15,120 they're going to be affected in the hip 209 00:10:19,910 --> 00:10:17,400 pocket because fewer vaccinations will 210 00:10:21,620 --> 00:10:19,920 cost them dollars you know what I had an 211 00:10:24,170 --> 00:10:21,630 exchange on Facebook with one of these 212 00:10:25,129 --> 00:10:24,180 dipstick oh did you welcome official it 213 00:10:26,780 --> 00:10:25,139 probably was 214 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:26,790 Frankie exchange and I pointed out to 215 00:10:31,519 --> 00:10:28,970 her would you like to have polio back I 216 00:10:33,889 --> 00:10:31,529 mean I remember as a kid at school and 217 00:10:35,329 --> 00:10:33,899 my older listeners would remember this I 218 00:10:37,309 --> 00:10:35,339 think it was called something like 219 00:10:39,289 --> 00:10:37,319 saving it was an oral vaccine little 220 00:10:41,239 --> 00:10:39,299 pink vaccine and the health department 221 00:10:42,799 --> 00:10:41,249 came to the school and gave you this 222 00:10:44,900 --> 00:10:42,809 little spoonful of vaccine it wasn't a 223 00:10:46,789 --> 00:10:44,910 needle and that was a national program 224 00:10:48,710 --> 00:10:46,799 or silver certainly statewide in New 225 00:10:50,419 --> 00:10:48,720 South Wales and at the moment there's an 226 00:10:53,389 --> 00:10:50,429 epidemic and outbreak a massive outbreak 227 00:10:55,939 --> 00:10:53,399 of cholera in haiti and if you saw that 228 00:10:57,619 --> 00:10:55,949 during no I didn't so I mean we want all 229 00:10:58,789 --> 00:10:57,629 these diseases back doing that's a 230 00:11:01,210 --> 00:10:58,799 problem people have very short memories 231 00:11:03,650 --> 00:11:01,220 to get that measles used to kill very 232 00:11:08,379 --> 00:11:03,660 informal countries fruitful problem so 233 00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:11,090 we've got a call from Anthony Roberts 234 00:11:14,599 --> 00:11:12,569 our new south wales fair trading 235 00:11:15,859 --> 00:11:14,609 Minister how are you going Minister I'm 236 00:11:17,530 --> 00:11:15,869 very well and thank you very much for 237 00:11:20,530 --> 00:11:17,540 having me on the program those are nice 238 00:11:22,759 --> 00:11:20,540 trash tracys just given you a big rap 239 00:11:24,049 --> 00:11:22,769 well well thank you try if you've hit it 240 00:11:25,999 --> 00:11:24,059 right on the head but what we're asking 241 00:11:27,799 --> 00:11:26,009 this organization to do is to be upfront 242 00:11:29,989 --> 00:11:27,809 and honest with people and stop 243 00:11:33,079 --> 00:11:29,999 misleading people over an issue that 244 00:11:35,389 --> 00:11:33,089 puts young people you know their lives 245 00:11:37,909 --> 00:11:35,399 young children their lives at danger and 246 00:11:40,519 --> 00:11:37,919 for far too long this organization has 247 00:11:43,159 --> 00:11:40,529 been sleeping individuals and getting 248 00:11:45,769 --> 00:11:43,169 away with it yeah look mate we've got to 249 00:11:47,629 --> 00:11:45,779 rely surely on the medical professionals 250 00:11:48,949 --> 00:11:47,639 for some reason these people seem to 251 00:11:52,069 --> 00:11:48,959 think there's some sort of conspiracy 252 00:11:54,379 --> 00:11:52,079 going on with vaccinating children it's 253 00:11:55,669 --> 00:11:54,389 just mindless to me I mean the medical 254 00:11:58,009 --> 00:11:55,679 professionals we've got in this state 255 00:12:00,289 --> 00:11:58,019 are the best that I know of and you just 256 00:12:02,929 --> 00:12:00,299 go within surely I certainly and these 257 00:12:04,069 --> 00:12:02,939 people aren't about pro-choice these 258 00:12:06,739 --> 00:12:04,079 people are about pushing and 259 00:12:08,389 --> 00:12:06,749 anti-vaccination line and if you really 260 00:12:11,809 --> 00:12:08,399 hit it right on the head with respect 261 00:12:14,779 --> 00:12:11,819 for example the polio vaccine you only 262 00:12:16,159 --> 00:12:14,789 have to talk to I'm 42 have you talked 263 00:12:18,229 --> 00:12:16,169 to my parents you talk to people a 264 00:12:20,059 --> 00:12:18,239 little bit older than me the remembered 265 00:12:21,409 --> 00:12:20,069 at the times we're quite often in your 266 00:12:23,749 --> 00:12:21,419 class you would have in summoning 267 00:12:26,329 --> 00:12:23,759 calipers yes people in iron mums and 268 00:12:29,139 --> 00:12:26,339 here we have is a vaccine but this 269 00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:29,149 organization is totally opposed to 270 00:12:33,889 --> 00:12:31,410 minister is there anything else you can 271 00:12:35,809 --> 00:12:33,899 do to actually shut them down well 272 00:12:38,029 --> 00:12:35,819 certainly what we're trying to do here 273 00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:38,039 is we're just asking them to be honest 274 00:12:40,069 --> 00:12:38,730 and 275 00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:40,079 open with people because what they're 276 00:12:46,250 --> 00:12:43,730 pushing is voodoo science is causing 277 00:12:47,870 --> 00:12:46,260 causing we've had deaths whooping cough 278 00:12:49,460 --> 00:12:47,880 outbreaks but again when we had a 279 00:12:51,530 --> 00:12:49,470 measles outbreak this organization 280 00:12:55,300 --> 00:12:51,540 pushed it around that in fact it was a 281 00:12:58,879 --> 00:12:55,310 major conspiracy to push the the vaccine 282 00:13:00,740 --> 00:12:58,889 well so again to parents out there you 283 00:13:02,600 --> 00:13:00,750 know if you don't vaccinate your child 284 00:13:04,370 --> 00:13:02,610 you are putting your child at risk and 285 00:13:07,220 --> 00:13:04,380 also you're putting other other people's 286 00:13:09,860 --> 00:13:07,230 children at risk yeah so so so again if 287 00:13:12,470 --> 00:13:09,870 you want medical advice actually talk to 288 00:13:15,920 --> 00:13:12,480 a doctor don't don't talk to ruth's like 289 00:13:17,180 --> 00:13:15,930 this and don't go on the web and and get 290 00:13:18,860 --> 00:13:17,190 all this sort of the gum from the rub 291 00:13:19,939 --> 00:13:18,870 don't talk to your local doctor and 292 00:13:22,610 --> 00:13:19,949 they'll tell you the importance of 293 00:13:24,470 --> 00:13:22,620 vaccinating your child Anthony you know 294 00:13:26,240 --> 00:13:24,480 it worries the life out of me that 295 00:13:28,670 --> 00:13:26,250 people do that i mean the Internet is a 296 00:13:31,009 --> 00:13:28,680 wonderful tool i love it we all love it 297 00:13:32,540 --> 00:13:31,019 but it's full of this stuff and you just 298 00:13:35,090 --> 00:13:32,550 got to make sure it's right before you 299 00:13:37,670 --> 00:13:35,100 go with it and a lot of it's not a look 300 00:13:39,680 --> 00:13:37,680 in a lot of these nut jobs and are using 301 00:13:41,840 --> 00:13:39,690 a technical term you know these are 302 00:13:43,970 --> 00:13:41,850 people that purport and there's far too 303 00:13:46,250 --> 00:13:43,980 much of your right self-diagnosis by by 304 00:13:48,170 --> 00:13:46,260 google these days the issue here is that 305 00:13:50,420 --> 00:13:48,180 these are people that push the strange 306 00:13:52,490 --> 00:13:50,430 diets you know the brie the Aryans for 307 00:13:55,430 --> 00:13:52,500 example the sort of people you meet on 308 00:13:56,780 --> 00:13:55,440 these websites but yeah you don't eat 309 00:13:57,829 --> 00:13:56,790 all your you don't drink what you do is 310 00:14:00,079 --> 00:13:57,839 you surround yourself with positive 311 00:14:02,210 --> 00:14:00,089 vibes and and breathing natural earring 312 00:14:04,400 --> 00:14:02,220 look again people have just got to show 313 00:14:05,870 --> 00:14:04,410 some common sense and where you have 314 00:14:09,319 --> 00:14:05,880 particularly where these people are 315 00:14:12,290 --> 00:14:09,329 strong you have outbreaks of whooping 316 00:14:13,610 --> 00:14:12,300 cough and you come across those awful 317 00:14:15,620 --> 00:14:13,620 stories of people moving into these 318 00:14:17,059 --> 00:14:15,630 areas with children that are too young 319 00:14:19,490 --> 00:14:17,069 to be vaccinated of the whooping cough 320 00:14:21,680 --> 00:14:19,500 it in one case picking whooping cough 321 00:14:24,170 --> 00:14:21,690 cough up which is I've got a little boy 322 00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:24,180 who's 3 and 1 is 1 and and you've just 323 00:14:28,309 --> 00:14:26,490 got to see the images of what whooping 324 00:14:30,860 --> 00:14:28,319 cough does and if the deaths that have 325 00:14:33,949 --> 00:14:30,870 occurred to really focus you on the 326 00:14:36,650 --> 00:14:33,959 statuses people are not just not like 327 00:14:38,689 --> 00:14:36,660 not just lie these people putting young 328 00:14:40,160 --> 00:14:38,699 people's lives at risk can I just say 329 00:14:42,259 --> 00:14:40,170 Minister thank you so much for calling 330 00:14:43,610 --> 00:14:42,269 in and speaking so strongly about this 331 00:14:46,579 --> 00:14:43,620 issue that a lot of people have been 332 00:14:48,290 --> 00:14:46,589 angry about gosh forever in a day thank 333 00:14:49,699 --> 00:14:48,300 you goodnight pleasure thank you very 334 00:14:51,559 --> 00:14:49,709 much for your support thanks for jumping 335 00:14:52,610 --> 00:14:51,569 on the phone one of the great 336 00:14:55,160 --> 00:14:52,620 broadcasters vault 337 00:14:57,170 --> 00:14:55,170 lawzy had polio as a child and he'll 338 00:14:58,430 --> 00:14:57,180 tell you and we have lunch a few of us 339 00:14:59,750 --> 00:14:58,440 have lunch with us a few times a year 340 00:15:02,000 --> 00:14:59,760 and it'll tell you you know awful 341 00:15:03,230 --> 00:15:02,010 stories about that and how he thought 342 00:15:05,510 --> 00:15:03,240 his life was going to be changed forever 343 00:15:07,100 --> 00:15:05,520 he recovered thankfully but he had it I 344 00:15:09,470 --> 00:15:07,110 mean that's the thing I mean it's my 345 00:15:11,180 --> 00:15:09,480 vintage we got that vaccine and I to 346 00:15:12,740 --> 00:15:11,190 come aboard was cool but it was an oral 347 00:15:15,020 --> 00:15:12,750 one and I remember it pink a little 348 00:15:18,920 --> 00:15:15,030 spoon we all lined up in the gob and way 349 00:15:21,080 --> 00:15:18,930 you win moving on now and a 350 00:15:23,090 --> 00:15:21,090 controversial anti-vaccination group has 351 00:15:25,310 --> 00:15:23,100 been ordered to change its name because 352 00:15:26,810 --> 00:15:25,320 it's misleading the public New South 353 00:15:28,730 --> 00:15:26,820 Wales Office of Fair Trading has 354 00:15:30,650 --> 00:15:28,740 presented the Australian vaccination 355 00:15:32,810 --> 00:15:30,660 network with a formal letter of action 356 00:15:35,390 --> 00:15:32,820 it must lodge an application to register 357 00:15:37,550 --> 00:15:35,400 a new name by the 21st of februari or 358 00:15:39,620 --> 00:15:37,560 face cancellation the Fair Trading 359 00:15:41,840 --> 00:15:39,630 Minister Anthony Roberts says the avian 360 00:15:43,940 --> 00:15:41,850 doesn't present a balanced case of for 361 00:15:46,040 --> 00:15:43,950 vaccination and he's liking the group's 362 00:15:48,710 --> 00:15:46,050 message to allowing a speeding motorist 363 00:15:49,700 --> 00:15:48,720 to endanger others on the road now mo 364 00:15:51,860 --> 00:15:49,710 what do you think about this is the 365 00:15:53,780 --> 00:15:51,870 right thing to do to to make this 366 00:15:55,700 --> 00:15:53,790 anti-vaccination organization change 367 00:15:58,760 --> 00:15:55,710 their their name so they don't mislead 368 00:16:02,420 --> 00:15:58,770 parents I think so I mean their message 369 00:16:04,340 --> 00:16:02,430 seems to me disastrous because the the 370 00:16:06,560 --> 00:16:04,350 child that's not vaccinated ends up 371 00:16:09,320 --> 00:16:06,570 infecting the child his vaccination 372 00:16:11,570 --> 00:16:09,330 maybe do or his vet vaccination was 373 00:16:14,030 --> 00:16:11,580 ineffective or not fully effective so 374 00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:14,040 anything we can do to at least make sure 375 00:16:19,100 --> 00:16:16,050 that they are who they claim to be or 376 00:16:21,200 --> 00:16:19,110 seem to be rather than some sort of 377 00:16:23,390 --> 00:16:21,210 information group on the issue generally 378 00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:23,400 good luck to Anthony Roberts the 379 00:16:26,780 --> 00:16:25,290 minister Katherine the minister says the 380 00:16:28,670 --> 00:16:26,790 information they provide as a matter of 381 00:16:30,620 --> 00:16:28,680 life of death is a fair enough that 382 00:16:31,820 --> 00:16:30,630 consumers know where this organization 383 00:16:33,500 --> 00:16:31,830 is coming from because if you look at 384 00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:33,510 their website they they say they're just 385 00:16:37,490 --> 00:16:35,010 promoting choice they don't actually 386 00:16:40,670 --> 00:16:37,500 admit to being anti-vaccination what a 387 00:16:42,710 --> 00:16:40,680 load of rubbish oh I'm sorry I'm not 388 00:16:45,290 --> 00:16:42,720 going to stand up for this group's human 389 00:16:47,720 --> 00:16:45,300 rights or freedom of expression you know 390 00:16:50,540 --> 00:16:47,730 parents should vaccinate their kids it's 391 00:16:52,700 --> 00:16:50,550 a public health necessity I have no 392 00:16:55,400 --> 00:16:52,710 sympathy or you know doesn't pull at my 393 00:16:56,930 --> 00:16:55,410 heartstrings Steve that that they need 394 00:16:58,490 --> 00:16:56,940 to disclose to the public what they're 395 00:16:59,900 --> 00:16:58,500 on about I think that's a good that's a 396 00:17:01,430 --> 00:16:59,910 good thing it's interesting if you look 397 00:17:04,100 --> 00:17:01,440 at their website though they do say that 398 00:17:04,679 --> 00:17:04,110 they're victims of you know their human 399 00:17:07,689 --> 00:17:04,689 rights here 400 00:17:09,429 --> 00:17:07,699 persecution yes I think not I think 401 00:17:12,069 --> 00:17:09,439 people who don't vaccinate their kids 402 00:17:13,780 --> 00:17:12,079 are perpetrating a form of persecution 403 00:17:16,329 --> 00:17:13,790 so let's stay on the main game with this 404 00:17:18,549 --> 00:17:16,339 one I think Pete the avian says forcing 405 00:17:20,140 --> 00:17:18,559 them to change their own name is not in 406 00:17:21,880 --> 00:17:20,150 the public interest it's only in the 407 00:17:24,280 --> 00:17:21,890 interest of pharmaceutical companies 408 00:17:27,370 --> 00:17:24,290 government policy and mainstream medical 409 00:17:29,320 --> 00:17:27,380 organizations taking the the specific 410 00:17:31,240 --> 00:17:29,330 issue of vaccination aside I don't know 411 00:17:32,830 --> 00:17:31,250 about Fair Trading starting to move into 412 00:17:34,780 --> 00:17:32,840 polities you can just imagine them 413 00:17:36,940 --> 00:17:34,790 calling in Labor's not labor anymore 414 00:17:40,510 --> 00:17:36,950 bringing fed know liberals left in the 415 00:17:43,210 --> 00:17:40,520 Liberal Party greens approved a damn so 416 00:17:46,450 --> 00:17:43,220 you know fair work australia essential 417 00:17:48,280 --> 00:17:46,460 media isn't essential more jobs better 418 00:17:50,350 --> 00:17:48,290 pay the legislation is well but it's 419 00:17:53,200 --> 00:17:50,360 interesting isn't it the importance of a 420 00:17:54,990 --> 00:17:53,210 name and a brand I don't know where the 421 00:17:57,549 --> 00:17:55,000 remit of Fair Trading goes with this 422 00:17:59,440 --> 00:17:57,559 well it would it would come down to the 423 00:18:01,180 --> 00:17:59,450 fact that this would be the race of 424 00:18:03,190 --> 00:18:01,190 funds community a community they're 425 00:18:05,620 --> 00:18:03,200 raising funds and also I guess it's 426 00:18:07,210 --> 00:18:05,630 about misleading the public on public 427 00:18:08,919 --> 00:18:07,220 health issues that are a matter of life 428 00:18:12,039 --> 00:18:08,929 of death recall the last heat out of 429 00:18:13,840 --> 00:18:12,049 fair trading in this space was the lobby 430 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:13,850 group that helped to really create 431 00:18:17,470 --> 00:18:16,010 Thompson on the Central Coast and they 432 00:18:19,870 --> 00:18:17,480 certainly had the power to what they 433 00:18:21,159 --> 00:18:19,880 call yeah it wasn't around their name 434 00:18:23,740 --> 00:18:21,169 but it was about where the funds were 435 00:18:26,320 --> 00:18:23,750 going so they do regulate organizations 436 00:18:28,180 --> 00:18:26,330 that raise funds so I'm sure I'm sure 437 00:18:29,980 --> 00:18:28,190 it's within within chattering status 438 00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:29,990 yeah and Catherine it's interesting that 439 00:18:34,450 --> 00:18:32,330 the area of New South Wales where this 440 00:18:38,110 --> 00:18:34,460 organization operates has a low 441 00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:38,120 vaccination rate which below the herd 442 00:18:42,130 --> 00:18:40,250 immunity level which in dangers the 443 00:18:44,020 --> 00:18:42,140 community to issues like whooping cough 444 00:18:47,020 --> 00:18:44,030 as well you know is that right I wasn't 445 00:19:01,450 --> 00:18:47,030 aware of that well but in Bolton's the 446 00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:04,630 on Saturday the ninth of februari 2013 447 00:19:11,500 --> 00:19:08,450 why not go to surfside summer Skepta 448 00:19:14,139 --> 00:19:11,510 camp come down the glorious Surf Coast 449 00:19:17,799 --> 00:19:14,149 for a summer skeptical event hosted by 450 00:19:19,419 --> 00:19:17,809 the great ocean road skeptics for more 451 00:19:22,230 --> 00:19:19,429 information if you're in that neck of 452 00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:22,240 the woods run to facebook and search for 453 00:19:36,940 --> 00:19:32,500 Maynard's Malays a very may not 454 00:19:38,620 --> 00:19:36,950 christmas 2012 yes mein Huns got his own 455 00:19:41,529 --> 00:19:38,630 show folks you know that I know that 456 00:19:44,500 --> 00:19:41,539 spread the word Maynard's Malays a very 457 00:19:48,779 --> 00:19:44,510 Maynard Christmas 2012 download for your 458 00:19:52,539 --> 00:19:48,789 listening pleasure visit w WM a nerd 459 00:20:06,580 --> 00:19:52,549 calm I you for Maynard's malaise and 460 00:20:09,950 --> 00:20:06,590 more here's may not spooky action at a 461 00:20:15,330 --> 00:20:13,049 look I'm talking to a man now just 462 00:20:17,039 --> 00:20:15,340 cynically near the men's toilets he's a 463 00:20:18,960 --> 00:20:17,049 man who's a shell of himself he's what 464 00:20:20,970 --> 00:20:18,970 are you saying about me because I'm just 465 00:20:23,759 --> 00:20:20,980 saying you're beaten said it is not the 466 00:20:26,100 --> 00:20:23,769 70s it's a very long weekend for someone 467 00:20:28,739 --> 00:20:26,110 like you isn't it yeah it's a long but 468 00:20:31,350 --> 00:20:28,749 gratifying weekend you know 12 hour days 469 00:20:34,379 --> 00:20:31,360 name of the game at something like this 470 00:20:36,659 --> 00:20:34,389 but it's so paradoxically invigorating 471 00:20:39,359 --> 00:20:36,669 long hours but puts wind in your sails 472 00:20:42,080 --> 00:20:39,369 talking to people who have traveled from 473 00:20:44,729 --> 00:20:42,090 all over Australia for this event and 474 00:20:46,799 --> 00:20:44,739 people are leaving renewed and sort of 475 00:20:48,539 --> 00:20:46,809 energized thinking about ways they can 476 00:20:51,539 --> 00:20:48,549 work together roll up their sleeves get 477 00:20:53,759 --> 00:20:51,549 good work done for you know advancing 478 00:20:55,769 --> 00:20:53,769 scientific skepticism in their neck of 479 00:20:57,479 --> 00:20:55,779 the woods it's exciting DJ you've got a 480 00:20:59,549 --> 00:20:57,489 lot of experience networking at these 481 00:21:01,289 --> 00:20:59,559 things you're very patient with people 482 00:21:03,090 --> 00:21:01,299 is this something you had to learn to be 483 00:21:04,799 --> 00:21:03,100 good at this or did you know I mean have 484 00:21:07,379 --> 00:21:04,809 you naturally been a good networker 485 00:21:09,029 --> 00:21:07,389 maybe have a good networker maybe I'm 486 00:21:10,799 --> 00:21:09,039 pretending maybe I'm actually an 487 00:21:13,229 --> 00:21:10,809 introvert who can't wait to get back to 488 00:21:15,690 --> 00:21:13,239 my hotel room and just read a book no 489 00:21:18,899 --> 00:21:15,700 really I like these people that these 490 00:21:20,220 --> 00:21:18,909 are my people this is my tribe we're 491 00:21:23,279 --> 00:21:20,230 social primates we like to be around 492 00:21:25,859 --> 00:21:23,289 people in general but these are the 493 00:21:28,919 --> 00:21:25,869 sorts of people that if someone has a 494 00:21:31,499 --> 00:21:28,929 good idea it gets contagious and it just 495 00:21:33,180 --> 00:21:31,509 floods conversation everybody starts 496 00:21:35,700 --> 00:21:33,190 talking about ways they can improve on 497 00:21:38,340 --> 00:21:35,710 it and make it better the skeptic 498 00:21:40,769 --> 00:21:38,350 community is not in need of good ideas 499 00:21:43,769 --> 00:21:40,779 and increasingly we're no longer in need 500 00:21:46,080 --> 00:21:43,779 of good folks to implement them either 501 00:21:47,759 --> 00:21:46,090 and that's what this weekend was all 502 00:21:51,149 --> 00:21:47,769 about you know people who won the awards 503 00:21:53,310 --> 00:21:51,159 this weekend they did so because of the 504 00:21:56,039 --> 00:21:53,320 great work they're doing citizens for 505 00:22:00,379 --> 00:21:56,049 what was that a friends of science and 506 00:22:03,899 --> 00:22:00,389 medicine right and the anti anti vax 507 00:22:05,129 --> 00:22:03,909 activities here such great work now did 508 00:22:06,419 --> 00:22:05,139 something come out of this weekend you 509 00:22:08,039 --> 00:22:06,429 didn't expect or something that will be 510 00:22:10,019 --> 00:22:08,049 great moving forward as they like to say 511 00:22:11,820 --> 00:22:10,029 well what I was very excited to hear 512 00:22:14,399 --> 00:22:11,830 about is 513 00:22:17,759 --> 00:22:14,409 the work in development for online 514 00:22:20,370 --> 00:22:17,769 citizens skepticism and of course there 515 00:22:22,740 --> 00:22:20,380 were lots of talk about plans and 516 00:22:24,960 --> 00:22:22,750 projects in the works regarding digital 517 00:22:28,110 --> 00:22:24,970 publishing and I heard someone talking 518 00:22:30,570 --> 00:22:28,120 about his really exciting plans to 519 00:22:33,269 --> 00:22:30,580 launch a new podcast on skeptical 520 00:22:35,759 --> 00:22:33,279 psychology or basically pushing back 521 00:22:38,039 --> 00:22:35,769 against pseudo psychology talked with a 522 00:22:40,950 --> 00:22:38,049 woman at the end of the sessions today 523 00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:40,960 about children's skeptical books and 524 00:22:44,100 --> 00:22:42,490 partnering with the jrf to make these 525 00:22:45,539 --> 00:22:44,110 available in the United States and 526 00:22:47,279 --> 00:22:45,549 really around the world you know when 527 00:22:50,460 --> 00:22:47,289 you're talking digital media they don't 528 00:22:54,210 --> 00:22:50,470 have nation state boundaries a podcast 529 00:22:56,100 --> 00:22:54,220 can be heard by anybody or the digital 530 00:22:58,350 --> 00:22:56,110 publications can be made available for 531 00:23:00,240 --> 00:22:58,360 anyone so I'm excited about that sort of 532 00:23:02,159 --> 00:23:00,250 stuff it is a long weekend you have to 533 00:23:04,110 --> 00:23:02,169 keep your eye on Randy because as you 534 00:23:05,430 --> 00:23:04,120 say yourself he'll talk until he drops 535 00:23:06,750 --> 00:23:05,440 you have to keep you have to just drag 536 00:23:08,340 --> 00:23:06,760 him away from people every once in a 537 00:23:10,259 --> 00:23:08,350 while well I wouldn't say drag him away 538 00:23:13,879 --> 00:23:10,269 but you know there's a balancing effort 539 00:23:15,810 --> 00:23:13,889 because he is he just feeds off the the 540 00:23:17,970 --> 00:23:15,820 sound a little new age here but the 541 00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:17,980 positive energy of these folks who care 542 00:23:22,830 --> 00:23:21,010 so much about doing good by being right 543 00:23:25,620 --> 00:23:22,840 that skepticism you know applying 544 00:23:27,810 --> 00:23:25,630 critical rationality to problems to undo 545 00:23:29,340 --> 00:23:27,820 credulity all of that stuff and we do it 546 00:23:32,070 --> 00:23:29,350 to make the world a better place that 547 00:23:35,129 --> 00:23:32,080 turns Randy on and he will talk and 548 00:23:38,460 --> 00:23:35,139 listen about it all day long few days 549 00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:38,470 ago he was giving a lecture to secondary 550 00:23:41,730 --> 00:23:40,330 college that's why I guess the high 551 00:23:43,950 --> 00:23:41,740 school and their junior high that's what 552 00:23:46,529 --> 00:23:43,960 you call it an amazing heat yeah an 553 00:23:49,889 --> 00:23:46,539 amazing heat it was a hundred degrees 554 00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:49,899 the AC was off I of course was prudently 555 00:23:53,970 --> 00:23:52,210 suggesting you know maybe no harm in 556 00:23:56,610 --> 00:23:53,980 canceling it's a hundred degrees there's 557 00:23:58,259 --> 00:23:56,620 300 kids in the in the seats you know 558 00:24:01,710 --> 00:23:58,269 they're not going to love sitting for an 559 00:24:04,620 --> 00:24:01,720 hour squirming in this heat he insisted 560 00:24:07,500 --> 00:24:04,630 no the show must go on he gave his our 561 00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:07,510 lecture we put a fan on him he did his 562 00:24:12,090 --> 00:24:10,690 escape he talked about how his 563 00:24:15,210 --> 00:24:12,100 background in magic informs his 564 00:24:17,250 --> 00:24:15,220 skeptical work he shared the stories 565 00:24:20,659 --> 00:24:17,260 about how the youngsters can apply 566 00:24:23,779 --> 00:24:20,669 skepticism to make their lives better 567 00:24:27,859 --> 00:24:23,789 and it was a smashing success despite 568 00:24:30,289 --> 00:24:27,869 the sauna heat that's Randy and so do i 569 00:24:32,930 --> 00:24:30,299 have to keep my honor certainly not but 570 00:24:35,869 --> 00:24:32,940 some times do I have to say oh it's been 571 00:24:37,999 --> 00:24:35,879 a long day I really can't wait until I 572 00:24:40,580 --> 00:24:38,009 hit the sack and sometimes he might take 573 00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:40,590 that hint yeah now look at finally just 574 00:24:43,729 --> 00:24:41,970 on a personal note here there's been a 575 00:24:46,039 --> 00:24:43,739 lot of talk about the controversy 576 00:24:48,619 --> 00:24:46,049 surrounding cam and that was your 577 00:24:50,479 --> 00:24:48,629 denialism of Bananarama your Bananarama 578 00:24:52,460 --> 00:24:50,489 denialism that came out in our interview 579 00:24:55,009 --> 00:24:52,470 and your Elton John ism which you 580 00:24:57,109 --> 00:24:55,019 blatantly pushed I you still adamant 581 00:24:59,779 --> 00:24:57,119 about that or you an apologist I you 582 00:25:02,389 --> 00:24:59,789 know I have to admit when I'm wrong and 583 00:25:04,700 --> 00:25:02,399 that's a sign of a good skeptic I have 584 00:25:06,889 --> 00:25:04,710 recently become a convert to Bananarama 585 00:25:10,430 --> 00:25:06,899 the details of which i will leave 586 00:25:12,769 --> 00:25:10,440 private because even open transparent 587 00:25:14,749 --> 00:25:12,779 skeptics like myself have to keep what 588 00:25:16,340 --> 00:25:14,759 they do with Bananarama to themselves 589 00:25:17,629 --> 00:25:16,350 okay it's great you've set the record 590 00:25:20,869 --> 00:25:17,639 straight and what do you do after a 591 00:25:22,909 --> 00:25:20,879 conference like this to one down I am 592 00:25:25,759 --> 00:25:22,919 really into comic books and I have 593 00:25:28,609 --> 00:25:25,769 thousands of them on my iPad so that you 594 00:25:30,499 --> 00:25:28,619 know that's always fun I'll tell you but 595 00:25:31,999 --> 00:25:30,509 I'm sure you won't tell anyone else yeah 596 00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:32,009 we wouldn't be a cherry popped out guy 597 00:25:35,359 --> 00:25:33,570 would you're not I don't even know what 598 00:25:38,299 --> 00:25:35,369 that means but it sounds vulgar it is 599 00:25:41,169 --> 00:25:38,309 yeah okay so make mine marvel marvel 600 00:25:43,549 --> 00:25:41,179 universe comic books that's fine and so 601 00:25:47,269 --> 00:25:43,559 I'm sure you'll keep it to yourself but 602 00:25:49,070 --> 00:25:47,279 I take baths all the time every day I 603 00:25:50,989 --> 00:25:49,080 take a bath and I read some comic books 604 00:25:52,549 --> 00:25:50,999 and that's my idea of winding down 605 00:25:54,289 --> 00:25:52,559 eating toast in the bath having cup of 606 00:25:56,539 --> 00:25:54,299 tea it's fantastic yeah yeah and when I 607 00:25:58,220 --> 00:25:56,549 learned you know after ten years of 608 00:25:59,930 --> 00:25:58,230 taking a bath every day I never take 609 00:26:01,279 --> 00:25:59,940 showers unless I'm unfortunate enough to 610 00:26:04,460 --> 00:26:01,289 be in a hotel room that doesn't have a 611 00:26:06,739 --> 00:26:04,470 bath after ten years this sort of 612 00:26:08,570 --> 00:26:06,749 lifestyle commitment learning that none 613 00:26:10,220 --> 00:26:08,580 other than the guy who's responsible for 614 00:26:12,289 --> 00:26:10,230 the world economic collapse Alan 615 00:26:15,139 --> 00:26:12,299 Greenspan also takes morning baths every 616 00:26:19,099 --> 00:26:15,149 day well I'm in good company DJ Grothe 617 00:26:20,989 --> 00:26:19,109 long may you bathe long may I bathe yes 618 00:26:23,850 --> 00:26:20,999 made it pleasure to talk to you again 619 00:26:26,710 --> 00:26:23,860 good seeing you this time 620 00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:26,720 look I'm just going to the the muses 621 00:26:30,549 --> 00:26:28,850 corner now where the mic stand set up 622 00:26:32,650 --> 00:26:30,559 for a bit of music a bit later but I 623 00:26:34,270 --> 00:26:32,660 ranza gave how are you I'm very well 624 00:26:36,190 --> 00:26:34,280 thank you how are you pretty good in 625 00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:36,200 congratulations on making the top 5 626 00:26:39,970 --> 00:26:38,330 good-looking guys in Chrissy's all the 627 00:26:42,870 --> 00:26:39,980 special list of sexy skeptical men 628 00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:42,880 yesterday yeah well the list comprised 629 00:26:47,980 --> 00:26:46,010 Randy at number 5 Lord Monckton as 630 00:26:50,650 --> 00:26:47,990 number four because he has a head like a 631 00:26:53,410 --> 00:26:50,660 goldfish giant goldfish I was at number 632 00:26:55,770 --> 00:26:53,420 three and embarrassingly Richard Dawkins 633 00:26:58,330 --> 00:26:55,780 what I was at number two ahead of me so 634 00:27:00,150 --> 00:26:58,340 so yeah well Richard Saunders was a 635 00:27:02,110 --> 00:27:00,160 number one by the way so yeah so yeah 636 00:27:03,940 --> 00:27:02,120 behind Richard Dawkins I'm not so sure 637 00:27:05,890 --> 00:27:03,950 about that I I need to have a chat with 638 00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:05,900 Krissy yeah I think she have a deep chat 639 00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:07,730 with her you've been to many of these 640 00:27:11,020 --> 00:27:09,530 over the years how does this skeptical 641 00:27:12,430 --> 00:27:11,030 conference stack up compared to other 642 00:27:14,350 --> 00:27:12,440 ones is there any different bent to it 643 00:27:16,870 --> 00:27:14,360 any different make up any different feel 644 00:27:18,549 --> 00:27:16,880 well I think I think it continues with 645 00:27:22,360 --> 00:27:18,559 the shift we've seen over several years 646 00:27:24,460 --> 00:27:22,370 now of the that can't the content being 647 00:27:26,110 --> 00:27:24,470 the kind of things that actually appeals 648 00:27:28,150 --> 00:27:26,120 more to a younger audience there's more 649 00:27:29,799 --> 00:27:28,160 about the internet about about being 650 00:27:31,390 --> 00:27:29,809 very active about skeptics in the pub 651 00:27:34,630 --> 00:27:31,400 about the kind of things that actually 652 00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:34,640 in my opinion exemplify what the 653 00:27:38,590 --> 00:27:36,410 skeptical movement the modern skeptical 654 00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:38,600 movement is and what it's all about so I 655 00:27:43,900 --> 00:27:40,490 think it's great you know we have a 656 00:27:46,510 --> 00:27:43,910 great lineup of speakers here I think so 657 00:27:49,120 --> 00:27:46,520 far every single talk was great the 658 00:27:51,430 --> 00:27:49,130 panels were great I think for me the 659 00:27:55,299 --> 00:27:51,440 highlights were Adam yesterday Adam van 660 00:27:58,870 --> 00:27:55,309 Lang about yesterday and in Lawrence 661 00:28:00,340 --> 00:27:58,880 this morning both of whom I I know and 662 00:28:02,409 --> 00:28:00,350 like and that they're funny and 663 00:28:04,299 --> 00:28:02,419 inspiring and they actually do things 664 00:28:06,820 --> 00:28:04,309 and get out there and make a difference 665 00:28:08,770 --> 00:28:06,830 so yeah it reads me great so far and 666 00:28:10,299 --> 00:28:08,780 just the listeners many of them might 667 00:28:11,350 --> 00:28:10,309 know that you've started a new job and 668 00:28:12,610 --> 00:28:11,360 that's one the reasons why you had to 669 00:28:13,570 --> 00:28:12,620 step down as president of course you 670 00:28:14,620 --> 00:28:13,580 were stabbed in the back by lots of 671 00:28:15,970 --> 00:28:14,630 people as well that's another thing that 672 00:28:17,350 --> 00:28:15,980 was blood all over the floor it was a 673 00:28:18,909 --> 00:28:17,360 hell of a time wasn't it oh it was 674 00:28:20,049 --> 00:28:18,919 fantastic it has a job coming along how 675 00:28:24,310 --> 00:28:20,059 you're balancing the work-life balance 676 00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:24,320 at the moment life all the work started 677 00:28:27,880 --> 00:28:26,570 this guys are hard work you think he 678 00:28:29,409 --> 00:28:27,890 worked hard for the skeptics imagine 679 00:28:32,140 --> 00:28:29,419 what he does for his family people well 680 00:28:33,270 --> 00:28:32,150 I'll tell you I will be arriving home 681 00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:33,280 tonight at about it 682 00:28:39,300 --> 00:28:35,890 p.m. and tomorrow morning at 8am on a 683 00:28:41,730 --> 00:28:39,310 flight to India so yeah so for two weeks 684 00:28:43,050 --> 00:28:41,740 of for work so it's it's it's a 685 00:28:44,550 --> 00:28:43,060 challenge but it's not it's you know 686 00:28:46,020 --> 00:28:44,560 it's the right you know different stages 687 00:28:47,730 --> 00:28:46,030 in life there's different things and 688 00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:47,740 this is the right thing of this moment 689 00:28:51,630 --> 00:28:49,810 so it's it so it's great now let me ask 690 00:28:54,810 --> 00:28:51,640 you about the bent spoon award that last 691 00:28:56,340 --> 00:28:54,820 night went to homeopathy plus is it does 692 00:28:58,020 --> 00:28:56,350 it ever get acknowledged by the winner 693 00:28:59,490 --> 00:28:58,030 in the history that you've been involved 694 00:29:01,770 --> 00:28:59,500 with the bent spoon award is the winner 695 00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:01,780 ever acknowledged getting it the only 696 00:29:07,740 --> 00:29:04,330 time that I know of was Meryl dori two 697 00:29:09,810 --> 00:29:07,750 years ago no sorry three years ago Meryl 698 00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:09,820 dori did acknowledge the the bent spoon 699 00:29:13,650 --> 00:29:12,610 she basically took it as a badge of 700 00:29:16,350 --> 00:29:13,660 honor which is completely understandable 701 00:29:21,120 --> 00:29:16,360 i think if if she gave us some kind of 702 00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:21,130 quack equivalent the award i think we 703 00:29:24,300 --> 00:29:22,450 would probably acknowledge it and they 704 00:29:25,970 --> 00:29:24,310 take it as a badge of honor can you 705 00:29:29,340 --> 00:29:25,980 expect a reaction from her path a plus i 706 00:29:30,630 --> 00:29:29,350 I don't know you see um Frannie's an odd 707 00:29:32,550 --> 00:29:30,640 one first by the way it wasn't 708 00:29:35,310 --> 00:29:32,560 homeopathy plastic what is it was Fran 709 00:29:38,540 --> 00:29:35,320 herself French a field fan is an odd one 710 00:29:41,940 --> 00:29:38,550 because she she displays she has she has 711 00:29:45,030 --> 00:29:41,950 moments of lucidity among all the 712 00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:45,040 craziness for example she actually came 713 00:29:49,740 --> 00:29:47,650 out against the anti-vaccination against 714 00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:49,750 the IV n for not saying they're against 715 00:29:54,810 --> 00:29:51,130 vaccines and other which seemed quite 716 00:29:56,580 --> 00:29:54,820 reasonable which is very odd I I think 717 00:29:58,920 --> 00:29:56,590 she might and she might not i wouldn't 718 00:30:00,150 --> 00:29:58,930 be surprised by either but it does 719 00:30:01,890 --> 00:30:00,160 really matter i mean we do it's an 720 00:30:03,420 --> 00:30:01,900 internal kind of thing and he provides a 721 00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:03,430 little bit of publicity and the press 722 00:30:08,660 --> 00:30:06,370 likes it and and when when we are when 723 00:30:10,980 --> 00:30:08,670 people write about us in there in the 724 00:30:12,660 --> 00:30:10,990 general press i think we often they 725 00:30:14,580 --> 00:30:12,670 refer to the bed spoon so i think it's 726 00:30:16,530 --> 00:30:14,590 it's a bit of a laugh now what do you 727 00:30:20,130 --> 00:30:16,540 find these strangest claim you've heard 728 00:30:23,070 --> 00:30:20,140 from homeopathy a few weeks ago there 729 00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:23,080 was one about homeopathy for domestic 730 00:30:27,450 --> 00:30:25,450 violence I think that's the that's the I 731 00:30:31,560 --> 00:30:27,460 think that's the weirdest one so was it 732 00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:31,570 simply a calming medicine or something 733 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:33,250 I'm and how does it work it was quite 734 00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:35,290 quite specific it was quite specific 735 00:30:41,070 --> 00:30:38,770 it's homeopathy can treat domestic 736 00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:41,080 violence there was a whole explanation 737 00:30:44,419 --> 00:30:42,730 there but I don't think there's any need 738 00:30:45,739 --> 00:30:44,429 to go into it because so 739 00:30:48,379 --> 00:30:45,749 frankly not saying anything would be 740 00:30:49,609 --> 00:30:48,389 just as beneficial oh okay well I'll let 741 00:30:51,350 --> 00:30:49,619 you get back in there to get down there 742 00:30:52,759 --> 00:30:51,360 somebody met this weekend that you've 743 00:30:56,960 --> 00:30:52,769 enjoyed meeting you haven't bumped into 744 00:30:59,149 --> 00:30:56,970 before um no I think a look I've known a 745 00:31:00,710 --> 00:30:59,159 lot of you know I've been I quite like 746 00:31:02,330 --> 00:31:00,720 different been around the traps I've 747 00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:02,340 been around the trap so I but it's you 748 00:31:05,239 --> 00:31:03,690 know it's always great to meet the same 749 00:31:07,190 --> 00:31:05,249 people again I haven't met Lee and Kelly 750 00:31:09,109 --> 00:31:07,200 in a few years and Lynn Kelly's been 751 00:31:10,669 --> 00:31:09,119 very influential for me if she used to 752 00:31:12,649 --> 00:31:10,679 help me with some personal stuff because 753 00:31:15,289 --> 00:31:12,659 she's an educator and teacher an idea so 754 00:31:17,060 --> 00:31:15,299 things with my kids so so it was good to 755 00:31:19,039 --> 00:31:17,070 meet her again after see her again after 756 00:31:21,230 --> 00:31:19,049 quite a while but but otherwise I think 757 00:31:22,669 --> 00:31:21,240 I know most of the people that have met 758 00:31:23,899 --> 00:31:22,679 here today and but it's great to meet 759 00:31:26,629 --> 00:31:23,909 old friends again you know it's always a 760 00:31:28,190 --> 00:31:26,639 fantastic fantastic thing to to do you 761 00:31:30,619 --> 00:31:28,200 know you the same thing as we when we go 762 00:31:32,690 --> 00:31:30,629 to Tam in Vegas you know that it's more 763 00:31:34,249 --> 00:31:32,700 of the social event than it is the talks 764 00:31:36,109 --> 00:31:34,259 and all that it's like hanging with the 765 00:31:37,279 --> 00:31:36,119 like-minded people and can I just wish 766 00:31:38,149 --> 00:31:37,289 you all the best with the business and 767 00:31:39,169 --> 00:31:38,159 the work because I'm sure all the 768 00:31:40,549 --> 00:31:39,179 listeners are wondering where you've got 769 00:31:44,869 --> 00:31:40,559 to and that we all wish you the best as 770 00:31:46,489 --> 00:31:44,879 well thank you very much minute you know 771 00:31:47,930 --> 00:31:46,499 they're rushing and flushing and hashing 772 00:31:50,450 --> 00:31:47,940 is a little bit here at lunchtime here 773 00:31:52,999 --> 00:31:50,460 on day two on day two of the test of the 774 00:31:54,230 --> 00:31:53,009 skeptics versus the boredom dr. rachey 775 00:31:56,450 --> 00:31:54,240 what do you been up to here on this 776 00:31:58,369 --> 00:31:56,460 Sunday um well i'm about to give my talk 777 00:32:00,049 --> 00:31:58,379 actually made up now what are you 778 00:32:01,820 --> 00:32:00,059 talking about well what's your topic I'm 779 00:32:03,619 --> 00:32:01,830 smarter than you so just get under the 780 00:32:06,289 --> 00:32:03,629 house I believe that's the title of it 781 00:32:07,690 --> 00:32:06,299 something like that yeah no it's 782 00:32:09,889 --> 00:32:07,700 actually it's going to be about 783 00:32:12,889 --> 00:32:09,899 skepticism in science and applying the 784 00:32:14,989 --> 00:32:12,899 skeptical approach to scientific method 785 00:32:17,210 --> 00:32:14,999 and do scientists ever go too far with 786 00:32:19,129 --> 00:32:17,220 that and therefore miss maybe some 787 00:32:21,590 --> 00:32:19,139 important findings that could lead to 788 00:32:23,749 --> 00:32:21,600 some discoveries does that often happen 789 00:32:25,430 --> 00:32:23,759 when they attempted meta-analysis of a 790 00:32:28,999 --> 00:32:25,440 number of different experiments like 791 00:32:31,279 --> 00:32:29,009 I've told if you have been obviously 120 792 00:32:32,659 --> 00:32:31,289 yeah if you do a number of different if 793 00:32:34,220 --> 00:32:32,669 you observe enough from different 794 00:32:35,749 --> 00:32:34,230 experiments then just take the metadata 795 00:32:38,539 --> 00:32:35,759 and stick it all together you can make 796 00:32:40,009 --> 00:32:38,549 mistakes and meta-analysis no because 797 00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:40,019 the meta-analysis is just really the 798 00:32:46,340 --> 00:32:43,770 next stage and analysis of a bunch of 799 00:32:47,870 --> 00:32:46,350 results so mostly what happened seems 800 00:32:49,870 --> 00:32:47,880 I've read the first two chapters a bad 801 00:32:52,310 --> 00:32:49,880 farmer and I haven't read the rest so I 802 00:32:54,710 --> 00:32:52,320 saw an another first bit of the argument 803 00:32:56,360 --> 00:32:54,720 well I haven't read bad farmer at all so 804 00:32:58,520 --> 00:32:56,370 okay we should have this discussion when 805 00:33:00,170 --> 00:32:58,530 we both read the port yeah well yeah I 806 00:33:01,730 --> 00:33:00,180 thought if I'd bet the first two 807 00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:01,740 chapters that that was all you had to do 808 00:33:05,660 --> 00:33:03,690 really well I mean there are people to 809 00:33:07,340 --> 00:33:05,670 criticize people that don't like the 810 00:33:08,780 --> 00:33:07,350 results of meta-analyses will criticize 811 00:33:11,900 --> 00:33:08,790 the meta-analysis because they'll say 812 00:33:13,280 --> 00:33:11,910 the data that proved their thinking or 813 00:33:15,140 --> 00:33:13,290 belief wasn't included in the 814 00:33:16,520 --> 00:33:15,150 meta-analysis now usually there's a 815 00:33:17,750 --> 00:33:16,530 reason for that Maynard and it's a 816 00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:17,760 scientific reason and that would be 817 00:33:23,330 --> 00:33:19,890 because that study wasn't done very well 818 00:33:25,520 --> 00:33:23,340 though some controls were missing or it 819 00:33:27,110 --> 00:33:25,530 just wasn't very thoroughly conducted so 820 00:33:28,910 --> 00:33:27,120 therefore it's excluded from the final 821 00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:28,920 analysis because it was basically shoddy 822 00:33:32,510 --> 00:33:31,170 and if you happen to believe in those 823 00:33:34,130 --> 00:33:32,520 shoddy results then you'll criticize 824 00:33:35,810 --> 00:33:34,140 meta-analysis ago oh they're all biased 825 00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:35,820 I believe there was a shoddy study 826 00:33:39,980 --> 00:33:37,650 recently done on the spot on that had to 827 00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:39,990 be withdrawn oh I don't know about that 828 00:33:43,810 --> 00:33:41,730 one yeah I heard about on skeptics guide 829 00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:43,820 to the universe that they they put out a 830 00:33:46,790 --> 00:33:45,570 preliminary study that seemed to 831 00:33:48,740 --> 00:33:46,800 indicate that there was a slightly 832 00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:48,750 elevated risk of some sort of cancer 833 00:33:52,580 --> 00:33:50,730 with the Spartan but then a week later 834 00:33:54,530 --> 00:33:52,590 they withdrew it because the the 835 00:33:56,870 --> 00:33:54,540 analysis was incorrect based on the data 836 00:33:59,270 --> 00:33:56,880 that was a little bit not it wasn't good 837 00:34:00,470 --> 00:33:59,280 really yeah I members but this is the 838 00:34:01,970 --> 00:34:00,480 thing about science is why don't you 839 00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:01,980 wonder why they put out they were that 840 00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:03,090 that thing in the first place the 841 00:34:06,290 --> 00:34:04,530 marketing department must have gone hey 842 00:34:07,730 --> 00:34:06,300 let's put this out the marketing 843 00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:07,740 department marketing department for the 844 00:34:12,889 --> 00:34:11,370 survey service up the marketing 845 00:34:14,240 --> 00:34:12,899 department for the particular uni or 846 00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:14,250 whatever was it did the experiment 847 00:34:17,750 --> 00:34:16,050 that's not all we need a catchy thing to 848 00:34:19,790 --> 00:34:17,760 get people's attention so probably went 849 00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:19,800 down to the bottom of the experiment 850 00:34:23,149 --> 00:34:20,970 somewhere and grab something that wasn't 851 00:34:25,220 --> 00:34:23,159 relevant look I mean that's that can 852 00:34:27,530 --> 00:34:25,230 also be there's many many steps along 853 00:34:29,260 --> 00:34:27,540 the scientific process where results can 854 00:34:31,250 --> 00:34:29,270 be misinterpreted and one of those is 855 00:34:33,169 --> 00:34:31,260 scientists never ever say a hundred 856 00:34:36,350 --> 00:34:33,179 percent yes or no we can't do that 857 00:34:38,090 --> 00:34:36,360 because by nature of statistical 858 00:34:40,490 --> 00:34:38,100 analysis we can only ever say we're at 859 00:34:42,290 --> 00:34:40,500 ninety-five percent right there's always 860 00:34:44,240 --> 00:34:42,300 an error for plus or minus five 861 00:34:46,310 --> 00:34:44,250 so we're always very cautious and will 862 00:34:47,540 --> 00:34:46,320 say there might be in effect but then 863 00:34:48,890 --> 00:34:47,550 some people will pick that up and go but 864 00:34:51,530 --> 00:34:48,900 the scientists said it's going to kill 865 00:34:53,510 --> 00:34:51,540 me so this Chinese whispers tends to 866 00:34:54,650 --> 00:34:53,520 happen well we've said all there might 867 00:34:56,600 --> 00:34:54,660 be a connection but we're not really 868 00:34:58,790 --> 00:34:56,610 sure how we need to do more research and 869 00:35:01,850 --> 00:34:58,800 we're not sure why yet but it could be 870 00:35:03,740 --> 00:35:01,860 this maybe it's that that gets snapped 871 00:35:05,930 --> 00:35:03,750 up by a PR department here go we're all 872 00:35:09,740 --> 00:35:05,940 gonna die and that kinda thing gonna be 873 00:35:12,020 --> 00:35:09,750 talking about on stage today I know I 874 00:35:13,160 --> 00:35:12,030 didn't know Richard III bumped into you 875 00:35:14,810 --> 00:35:13,170 cuz you've been in the back room doing 876 00:35:16,550 --> 00:35:14,820 those special deals the skeptics do it 877 00:35:18,590 --> 00:35:16,560 this kind of thing you know make making 878 00:35:20,420 --> 00:35:18,600 enemies it's like it's like being voted 879 00:35:21,620 --> 00:35:20,430 off the island skeptically bigger one of 880 00:35:23,270 --> 00:35:21,630 these things is no really it's like an 881 00:35:25,130 --> 00:35:23,280 episode of Survivor I can't tell you 882 00:35:27,170 --> 00:35:25,140 about these things may notice its secret 883 00:35:29,000 --> 00:35:27,180 the secret up to the so-called green 884 00:35:31,310 --> 00:35:29,010 room three times and nobody in there 885 00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:31,320 it's full now it is a lunch up there 886 00:35:34,370 --> 00:35:33,090 with James Randi and DJ Grothe and lots 887 00:35:36,860 --> 00:35:34,380 of people so don't go up there now 888 00:35:38,210 --> 00:35:36,870 you'll be kicked out okay what Leslie 889 00:35:39,530 --> 00:35:38,220 usually thing now I spoke to rebecca 890 00:35:41,390 --> 00:35:39,540 watson earlier about some wonderful 891 00:35:42,860 --> 00:35:41,400 things including Thunder shirts for dogs 892 00:35:44,420 --> 00:35:42,870 and cats which is the shirts that they 893 00:35:46,250 --> 00:35:44,430 wear to make them stop getting at 894 00:35:48,650 --> 00:35:46,260 anxious during thunderstorms and the 895 00:35:50,150 --> 00:35:48,660 bisexuality of James Bond so we've got 896 00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:50,160 some stuff that for great stuff for the 897 00:35:54,890 --> 00:35:53,490 show what well yeah well you when you 898 00:35:56,030 --> 00:35:54,900 talk to rebecca watson you talk pure 899 00:35:59,240 --> 00:35:56,040 science and that's what i was talking 900 00:36:01,670 --> 00:35:59,250 course science pure science may not be 901 00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:01,680 us right sounds interesting that sounds 902 00:36:04,250 --> 00:36:03,090 very interesting how's your convention 903 00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:04,260 with i look pretty good it's like 904 00:36:08,600 --> 00:36:06,690 everything arm now as you know i did 905 00:36:10,340 --> 00:36:08,610 about 90 degrees when i was at am in las 906 00:36:11,840 --> 00:36:10,350 vegas here in melbourne i think we've 907 00:36:14,060 --> 00:36:11,850 done about 50 which sounds about right 908 00:36:15,500 --> 00:36:14,070 and it's interesting that australians 909 00:36:17,510 --> 00:36:15,510 aren't is open to talking as the 910 00:36:19,190 --> 00:36:17,520 Americans in fact I don't think that's a 911 00:36:21,860 --> 00:36:19,200 problem I think it's the Americans had 912 00:36:23,210 --> 00:36:21,870 the problem with oversharing well that's 913 00:36:26,060 --> 00:36:23,220 that's one way of looking at it 914 00:36:28,100 --> 00:36:26,070 oversharing is very nice yes I don't 915 00:36:29,750 --> 00:36:28,110 know try to get a couple of bottles of 916 00:36:32,529 --> 00:36:29,760 vodka into the main art and they'll talk 917 00:36:34,929 --> 00:36:32,539 to anybody again there you go 918 00:36:36,159 --> 00:36:34,939 look we're here at a skeptics convention 919 00:36:37,809 --> 00:36:36,169 I'm talking to someone now who's wearing 920 00:36:39,370 --> 00:36:37,819 devil horns so why are you coming along 921 00:36:41,529 --> 00:36:39,380 as a character that most people who 922 00:36:43,569 --> 00:36:41,539 don't even believe in any way well I 923 00:36:45,519 --> 00:36:43,579 just want anybody you know any 924 00:36:48,909 --> 00:36:45,529 detractors to know that I don't fear 925 00:36:50,679 --> 00:36:48,919 hell so bring it on bro so basically all 926 00:36:53,079 --> 00:36:50,689 your devil horns are saying keep away 927 00:36:55,719 --> 00:36:53,089 from me the hormones are running in the 928 00:36:57,569 --> 00:36:55,729 bad way yeah ha and what he was seen 929 00:36:59,949 --> 00:36:57,579 here at this conference at you enjoy Oh 930 00:37:03,309 --> 00:36:59,959 everybody i mean the the lecturers have 931 00:37:06,219 --> 00:37:03,319 been so great and the amazing Randi a 932 00:37:08,259 --> 00:37:06,229 big hero of mine did you dirty tricks 933 00:37:10,979 --> 00:37:08,269 Lloyd of you some tricks oh yeah he did 934 00:37:14,469 --> 00:37:10,989 a great trick with a levitating matchbox 935 00:37:16,120 --> 00:37:14,479 yeah and I was absolutely mystified and 936 00:37:17,679 --> 00:37:16,130 when he explained it I was so 937 00:37:19,179 --> 00:37:17,689 embarrassed because you know I I 938 00:37:21,849 --> 00:37:19,189 considered myself a little bit of an 939 00:37:23,979 --> 00:37:21,859 amateur magician but yeah he's the 940 00:37:26,079 --> 00:37:23,989 master are you gonna try it when you go 941 00:37:28,120 --> 00:37:26,089 home because it just involves the folds 942 00:37:30,009 --> 00:37:28,130 of the skin doesn't it but the way can 943 00:37:31,870 --> 00:37:30,019 it's amazing it's not oh it's absolutely 944 00:37:33,459 --> 00:37:31,880 incredible yeah I'm gonna I'm gonna try 945 00:37:36,219 --> 00:37:33,469 it on my my housemate who unfortunately 946 00:37:37,929 --> 00:37:36,229 believes all the room so maybe I 947 00:37:40,029 --> 00:37:37,939 convince her that i actually have 948 00:37:41,769 --> 00:37:40,039 telekinetic powers now so when do have 949 00:37:43,479 --> 00:37:41,779 the great discussions with your flatmate 950 00:37:44,439 --> 00:37:43,489 is in the morning over the kitchen table 951 00:37:46,919 --> 00:37:44,449 or is it while you're watching 952 00:37:49,599 --> 00:37:46,929 late-night TV the arguments break out oh 953 00:37:52,959 --> 00:37:49,609 it's anytime she's like well I went to a 954 00:37:55,719 --> 00:37:52,969 tarot reader today and yeah it was 955 00:37:57,489 --> 00:37:55,729 incredible how did she know that I must 956 00:37:59,380 --> 00:37:57,499 own my own business I'm like yeah did 957 00:38:02,079 --> 00:37:59,390 you go on a weekday in the middle of the 958 00:38:03,969 --> 00:38:02,089 day and you had enough money to pay her 959 00:38:06,759 --> 00:38:03,979 I mean you can probably deduct those 960 00:38:08,229 --> 00:38:06,769 things she's like oh oh yeah yeah but 961 00:38:09,999 --> 00:38:08,239 don't there are other things you know 962 00:38:11,979 --> 00:38:10,009 that she just couldn't possibly have 963 00:38:13,390 --> 00:38:11,989 known I'd say you got conflict at home 964 00:38:15,099 --> 00:38:13,400 what about in the workplace do you work 965 00:38:17,589 --> 00:38:15,109 somewhere where occasionally a co-worker 966 00:38:20,709 --> 00:38:17,599 will come in going well my stars are 967 00:38:22,779 --> 00:38:20,719 just so right today oh yeah sometimes I 968 00:38:24,759 --> 00:38:22,789 here in the kitchen a bit of a bit of 969 00:38:26,589 --> 00:38:24,769 talk of i went to the best psychic on 970 00:38:28,719 --> 00:38:26,599 the weekend you should go see them as 971 00:38:30,939 --> 00:38:28,729 well and i just have to bite my tongue 972 00:38:32,380 --> 00:38:30,949 you know office politics oh yes you 973 00:38:33,939 --> 00:38:32,390 usually do now what is the whew that 974 00:38:36,490 --> 00:38:33,949 gets you the most what is the one that 975 00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:36,500 annoys you the most oh absolutely 976 00:38:42,940 --> 00:38:39,290 totally anything that's going to harm 977 00:38:44,890 --> 00:38:42,950 children especially in the medical area 978 00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:44,900 like chiropractics for children 979 00:38:48,910 --> 00:38:46,970 homeopathy for children not vaccinating 980 00:38:52,960 --> 00:38:48,920 them it just drives me up the wall that 981 00:38:55,540 --> 00:38:52,970 poor like complete innocence of being 982 00:38:58,810 --> 00:38:55,550 hurt by their stupid parents who just 983 00:39:00,850 --> 00:38:58,820 don't ever question like wow wonder why 984 00:39:03,100 --> 00:39:00,860 people these days it can live till 985 00:39:04,510 --> 00:39:03,110 ninety and yet a hundred years ago when 986 00:39:07,630 --> 00:39:04,520 they already had all these herbal 987 00:39:08,830 --> 00:39:07,640 medicines only lived till 30 and here's 988 00:39:11,170 --> 00:39:08,840 let's look at it from the other angle 989 00:39:13,180 --> 00:39:11,180 here what extraordinary claimed you wish 990 00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:13,190 was real I mean of all the extraordinary 991 00:39:16,240 --> 00:39:14,930 claims you hear from your flatmate from 992 00:39:18,040 --> 00:39:16,250 the people at work what's one that you 993 00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:18,050 would kind of like you go hey hang on 994 00:39:21,970 --> 00:39:19,850 flying sources that would be so cool and 995 00:39:23,740 --> 00:39:21,980 look I I think X tres fuels are out 996 00:39:25,810 --> 00:39:23,750 there I believe in UFOs I'm probably 997 00:39:30,190 --> 00:39:25,820 under skip together does that's my one 998 00:39:32,950 --> 00:39:30,200 was yours Mermaid Man why is it 999 00:39:34,390 --> 00:39:32,960 something childhood a movie yeah I was 1000 00:39:36,010 --> 00:39:34,400 kind of obsessed with that movie The 1001 00:39:38,050 --> 00:39:36,020 Little Mermaid when I was a kid and I I 1002 00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:38,060 just wanted to be able to like find out 1003 00:39:41,350 --> 00:39:39,770 one day that I'm secretly half mermaid 1004 00:39:42,940 --> 00:39:41,360 if I get in the water I can just swim 1005 00:39:44,350 --> 00:39:42,950 away from all the stupid people that 1006 00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:44,360 wouldn't that be inconvenient but you 1007 00:39:48,310 --> 00:39:45,770 you put your best bathing suit to go 1008 00:39:50,500 --> 00:39:48,320 down to some killed up here you jump in 1009 00:39:52,930 --> 00:39:50,510 and then suddenly oh no legs anymore I'm 1010 00:39:54,160 --> 00:39:52,940 fins yeah that would be a little bit 1011 00:39:55,660 --> 00:39:54,170 embarrassing yeah I mean when you think 1012 00:39:58,870 --> 00:39:55,670 of the Tom Hanks movie it wasn't all 1013 00:40:01,240 --> 00:39:58,880 that convenient no no but you know the 1014 00:40:03,970 --> 00:40:01,250 on the outside I won't have to swim in 1015 00:40:05,380 --> 00:40:03,980 the slow lane at the pool anymore yeah 1016 00:40:07,270 --> 00:40:05,390 of course we've got rebecca watson here 1017 00:40:10,180 --> 00:40:07,280 a bit of a fan of her oh definitely a 1018 00:40:11,710 --> 00:40:10,190 huge huge fan and now the word feisty is 1019 00:40:13,990 --> 00:40:11,720 always mentioned in the same sentence as 1020 00:40:17,500 --> 00:40:14,000 rebecca watson um well yeah what does it 1021 00:40:20,470 --> 00:40:17,510 matter you like oh I'm just so glad that 1022 00:40:22,510 --> 00:40:20,480 I know she's on a big podcast like the 1023 00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:22,520 SGU where you know all the other 1024 00:40:25,510 --> 00:40:23,810 panelists and even the guests are 1025 00:40:27,430 --> 00:40:25,520 usually man it's just good to have that 1026 00:40:29,410 --> 00:40:27,440 woman's perspective because I think 1027 00:40:33,670 --> 00:40:29,420 sometimes you know even the most 1028 00:40:35,860 --> 00:40:33,680 enlightened men they're not very closely 1029 00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:35,870 following issues especially skeptical 1030 00:40:39,400 --> 00:40:37,370 issues that are going to affect where 1031 00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:39,410 so it's good that she can bring it back 1032 00:40:44,410 --> 00:40:41,930 to that when other people may not have 1033 00:40:46,390 --> 00:40:44,420 noticed now I'm are you a fan of the 1034 00:40:48,610 --> 00:40:46,400 godless [\h__\h] podcast by the Atheist 1035 00:40:49,840 --> 00:40:48,620 community of Texas Austin Texas oh I 1036 00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:49,850 haven't heard of that line I have to 1037 00:40:53,050 --> 00:40:51,530 look it up it's another bourbon and look 1038 00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:53,060 where actually can you recommend a 1039 00:40:56,380 --> 00:40:55,130 website or a podcast and a book for us 1040 00:41:00,000 --> 00:40:56,390 to go because I've been asking people 1041 00:41:06,890 --> 00:41:02,790 I don't know if I can recommend anything 1042 00:41:11,580 --> 00:41:06,900 that no one would have heard of so far 1043 00:41:15,510 --> 00:41:11,590 and if you if you want a good read I'm 1044 00:41:17,310 --> 00:41:15,520 reading god no and other signs you may 1045 00:41:19,110 --> 00:41:17,320 be an atheist by Penn Jillette I think 1046 00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:19,120 that's quite an interesting book and 1047 00:41:22,770 --> 00:41:20,650 even though I don't agree with all his 1048 00:41:24,420 --> 00:41:22,780 opinions I think let me guess you have a 1049 00:41:26,070 --> 00:41:24,430 problem with the libertarianism do you 1050 00:41:28,350 --> 00:41:26,080 yes yeah I don't know if that's just an 1051 00:41:29,580 --> 00:41:28,360 Australian thing but I think because 1052 00:41:31,860 --> 00:41:29,590 we've got a bit of a socialized medicine 1053 00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:31,870 thing here we understand safety nets a 1054 00:41:35,940 --> 00:41:33,490 good idea where libertarians are not so 1055 00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:35,950 big on that larger safety net no no I 1056 00:41:39,390 --> 00:41:38,050 may disagree with him on that but it's 1057 00:41:41,730 --> 00:41:39,400 at least good to know another 1058 00:41:43,680 --> 00:41:41,740 perspective and how other skeptics 1059 00:41:45,630 --> 00:41:43,690 around the world think an atheist think 1060 00:41:47,520 --> 00:41:45,640 well I'm gonna get well away from your 1061 00:42:00,280 --> 00:41:47,530 devil horns now have a great day thank 1062 00:42:00,290 --> 00:42:08,490 in a world where the truth is a matter 1063 00:42:08,500 --> 00:42:16,310 your messages are a seat for beyond 1064 00:42:22,460 --> 00:42:19,640 and reason is sidelined for magical 1065 00:42:28,019 --> 00:42:25,420 only sweet then stand between the truth 1066 00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:28,029 temples 1067 00:42:32,829 --> 00:42:31,130 what date is it seven eight several 1068 00:42:34,240 --> 00:42:32,839 thing this is impressive it's a disaster 1069 00:42:36,299 --> 00:42:34,250 stand present they're not their 1070 00:42:39,460 --> 00:42:36,309 photographs of Chinese anthem it's not 1071 00:42:41,319 --> 00:42:39,470 we are not well received good god we're 1072 00:42:43,240 --> 00:42:41,329 fully don't discuss cryptozoology on the 1073 00:42:45,279 --> 00:42:43,250 show very often because we don't know 1074 00:42:47,079 --> 00:42:45,289 anything about how the truth the price 1075 00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:47,089 gets lower and lower and lower and then 1076 00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:49,010 he hits a ceiling it's just even for the 1077 00:42:54,970 --> 00:42:52,970 Rubin law profession skeptic to the K 1078 00:43:09,009 --> 00:42:54,980 for the mostest hi skeptics society find 1079 00:43:13,940 --> 00:43:11,509 thank you for listening to the skeptic 1080 00:43:17,690 --> 00:43:13,950 Cernan oh I'm so glad the world didn't 1081 00:43:19,160 --> 00:43:17,700 come to an end a few days ago I wonder 1082 00:43:22,700 --> 00:43:19,170 when the next end of the world 1083 00:43:24,890 --> 00:43:22,710 prediction will be or when that mystical 1084 00:43:28,459 --> 00:43:24,900 date will be I'm sure we'll find out 1085 00:43:30,259 --> 00:43:28,469 soon enough but for now from beautiful 1086 00:43:32,859 --> 00:43:30,269 Auckland what up what a beautiful city 1087 00:43:35,539 --> 00:43:32,869 it is New Zealand land of the hobbits 1088 00:43:37,759 --> 00:43:35,549 land a land of the hobbits I tell you 1089 00:43:40,279 --> 00:43:37,769 what when I flew here on a new zealand 1090 00:43:41,719 --> 00:43:40,289 the safety video is all done by hobbits 1091 00:43:44,420 --> 00:43:41,729 when i got off at the airport hobbits 1092 00:43:46,759 --> 00:43:44,430 everywhere but that's ok can't wait to 1093 00:43:49,819 --> 00:43:46,769 see the movie but for now this is 1094 00:43:56,299 --> 00:43:49,829 Richard Saunders signing off from 1095 00:43:59,690 --> 00:43:56,309 Auckland New Zealand you've been 1096 00:44:04,099 --> 00:43:59,700 listening to the skeptic zone visit her 1097 00:44:06,589 --> 00:44:04,109 website at www skeptics on TV for